Test Drove and Looking For Input and Feedback

[WetEV]

No doubts, I loved the Bolt, and it was the first non-Tesla car in a price range and distance range that I could even consider, but the practical grown-up side of me says that the distance and supporting infrastructure is not right for me at this point in time.

I really want to thank everyone who provided feedback and answers it is heartily appreciated. Your insight and answers greatly help me with my investigation and analysis.

Charging stations at the hotel and at the office park are still something you may want in the future. The Bolt isn't the end of electric car advancement. Please ask the hotel management and office park management about their plans, as electric cars are getting more common, passing 1% of car sales nationwide this past December.

125 mile commute would need a larger battery than the Bolt for "No Worries Range". Initially this would allow for a round trip with no charging at the destination in good conditions. With about an 80kWh battery, charging at the hotel and/or office park, you could make the round trip "No Worries", good or bad weather, in an old car, with no stops on the road, with margin.

You might get a cheap used electric for around town, and save the gas car for the long trips.

 

[EldRick]

You are the perfect user for a Volt - your daily mileage would easily fit with the battery operation, and the weekly trip would use gas. No need for remote recharges, just a 120v outlet at home.
(And the Volt costs less than a Bolt)

 

[iankh]

Yes, I've decided to just wait. I am positive that the infrastructure will change. Batteries are batteries and as I understand it, there is only just so far physics and chemistry can be stretched. However, I think the infrastructure will grow. How nice it would be to just be able to pull into a Starbucks, relax for 20 minutes and then drive away charged.

 

[boltage]

So, I did my weekly 250 mile roundtrip to Carlsbad this week in my little economy car and got 33.4 mpg, driving through a wind farm with strong head and side winds, up hills and up and over 2 mountain passes, my little car huffing and puffing on the extremely steep mountain passes. Not yet summer, but about 1/2 of the trip the external temp was 83 until I got closer to the ocean. The drive gave me a lot to think about.

You may want to compare the 33.4 mpg with (a) the EPA highway rating for the car, and (b) what Consumer Reports found for highway fuel economy for the car, if they tested it. That way, you can get an idea of how big a penalty the wind and hills make.

 

[iankh]

So, I did my weekly 250 mile roundtrip to Carlsbad this week in my little economy car and got 33.4 mpg, driving through a wind farm with strong head and side winds, up hills and up and over 2 mountain passes, my little car huffing and puffing on the extremely steep mountain passes. Not yet summer, but about 1/2 of the trip the external temp was 83 until I got closer to the ocean. The drive gave me a lot to think about.

You may want to compare the 33.4 mpg with (a) the EPA highway rating for the car, and (b) what Consumer Reports found for highway fuel economy for the car, if they tested it. That way, you can get an idea of how big a penalty the wind and hills make.

Consumer reports rated it as 30 mpg overall. The 33.4 I'm getting is based on about 20 to 40 miles a week city driving and 250 a week for the weekly drive to work.

 

[SparkE]

I've been looking at the Bolt and decided to test drive one yesterday which I probably shouldn't have done because I loved it. I live in Palm Springs and work from home for most of the week. Two days a week I have to be in the office and stay overnight. The total round trip for me is 250 miles, up and down steep hills plus AC is definitely needed during summer months. My biggest fear of course recharging while I'm in Carlsbad. The office park I work in does not have a charging station. There are a couple quite close to my hotel, but I'm not sure exactly how long it would take to charge enough to feel secure for the drive back.

I'm looking for feedback from those who already own a Bolt. This need to recharge while away from home would happen every week. Thanks for advice, feedback, insight or guidance you may be able to offer.

You don't HAVE to charge in Carlsbad - you just have to charge a bit (about 15-20 kWh) before you get 40-60 miles from home. If you get a vehicle with a DCFC plug (highly recommended if you are going to use it for 250-mile round-trips) then you can stop at any DCFC spot (that has a CCS plug) and pick up some electrons.

So, that being said, you can :
- ask at your preferred hotel (use one of their 120 or 240V plugs, and your EVSE - or ask if they are planning to install a charger). 3 hours on a 6.6 kW public station would be more than enough. Remind them you are there 30-45 times a year.
- ask for a great rate at a hotel that already has an EVSE or DCFC. Tell them (show them) the rate you get at the other hotel - see if they will match it - and tell them you will be staying there 30-45 times a year.
- ask to use a plug at work. They MAY already have a 240 plug somewhere. You can use an appropriate extension cord and a personal 240V EVSE to charge for 3-9 hours 'at work'.
- Stop at any of the multiple existing DCFCs between work and home for 15 minutes. According to plugshare :
+ McDonalds in Banning, CA. Greenlots. 50 kW. $0.29/kWh.
+ Wallmart in Moreno Valley, CA. Greenlots. 50 kW. $0.35/kWh.
+ North County Kia in Escondido. Greenlots. 50 kW. FREE!!.
+ Hilton Garden Inn, Carlsbad. ChargePoint network. 24 kW. $9/hr (so 16 kW prob costs around $6, about $0.40kWh)

And I hate EVgo, but there are another 20 or so EVgo stations between Carlsbad & Palm Springs, including four in Carlsbad, two in Cabazon and two in Palm Springs. If you subscribe to EVgo for $15/mo, you pay just $0.10/minute at DCFCs, which is around 14 cents/kWh if your battery is under 50% charged. EVgo L2 stations are $1/hr using that subscription. If you go that way, you might as well just charge at EVgo when it is convenient, even in Palm Springs (unless your electricity is cheaper than $0.14/kWh). But you don't NEED to use EVgo, as there are plenty of other options that exist already, not even counting the hotel & work possibilities that you haven't fully investigated yet.

Good luck with your decision!!

 

[iankh]

Rethinking this (again). Yesterday, after work, I visited the charging location a few miles from my hotel that is a EVgo with two chargers. I believe they are 50 amp? I drove by yesterday after work and is part of an outdoor discount mall located near Starbucks, and several eateries. Although very crowded, both chargers were available.

I drove by again this morning at about 6:30 AM and there was a car in one of the spots. I thought it might be an ICB but it was a Leaf. The owner happened to be walking back to his car and he told me that he can get up to 90% in about 30 minutes.

So, now I'm thinking this is very doable. I could either stop after work and hang out for 30 minutes, or, in the early morning, stop, charge and have coffee at Starbucks.

I think it's time to have another chat with the dealer in my area to see what they can do on a lease.

I've never leased a car before, always bought, but I'm thinking with the way technology moves, that it might be a detriment to own one as who knows what will develope in 3 years time.

 

[WetEV]

I could either stop after work and hang out for 30 minutes, or, in the early morning, stop, charge and have coffee at Starbucks.

I think it's time to have another chat with the dealer in my area to see what they can do on a lease.

Charging at the mall sounds like a great Plan B. Dual chargers mean somewhat less chance of a down charger.

I still suggest a chat with the hotel management about L2 charging stations for hotel guests. That's a better Plan A.

 

[SeanNelson]

...it was a Leaf. The owner happened to be walking back to his car and he told me that he can get up to 90% in about 30 minutes.

So, now I'm thinking this is very doable. I could either stop after work and hang out for 30 minutes, or, in the early morning, stop, charge and have coffee at Starbucks.

You probably know this already, but I feel compelled to point out that Leaf owner's comments don't apply to the Bolt. With its much larger battery, the Bolt will take much longer to charge to that level.

 

[iankh]

You probably know this already, but I feel compelled to point out that Leaf owner's comments don't apply to the Bolt. With its much larger battery, the Bolt will take much longer to charge to that level.

After the 125 mile drive I'll need to charge enough to get home. I'd like to charge it to get an additional 50 miles or so. Is this possible in 30 to 45 minutes?

 

[devbolt]

You probably know this already, but I feel compelled to point out that Leaf owner's comments don't apply to the Bolt. With its much larger battery, the Bolt will take much longer to charge to that level.

After the 125 mile drive I'll need to charge enough to get home. I'd like to charge it to get an additional 50 miles or so. Is this possible in 30 to 45 minutes?

Yes, you should be able to get 50 miles easily in those 30 minutes on a DC fast charger, especially if it is a 50 kW unit.

 

[GetOffYourGas]

You probably know this already, but I feel compelled to point out that Leaf owner's comments don't apply to the Bolt. With its much larger battery, the Bolt will take much longer to charge to that level.

After the 125 mile drive I'll need to charge enough to get home. I'd like to charge it to get an additional 50 miles or so. Is this possible in 30 to 45 minutes?

Yes, you should be able to get 50 miles easily in those 30 minutes on a DC fast charger, especially if it is a 50 kW unit.

I would double-check whether it is a 25kW or 50kW unit.

Rethinking this (again). Yesterday, after work, I visited the charging location a few miles from my hotel that is a EVgo with two charges. I believe they are 50 amp?

50A implies a 25kW unit. Max voltage is 500V, and 500V * 50A = 25kW.

How much power would you put into a Bolt in 30 minutes on a 25kW charger? You'd get maybe 10kWh into the battery (after losses). To get an additional 50 miles from that, you'd need to average 5 miles/kWh (aka no highway). Or you'd have to sit there for more like 45 minutes to charge.

 

[SparkE]

Rethinking this (again). Yesterday, after work, I visited the charging location a few miles from my hotel that is a EVgo with two chargers. I believe they are 50 amp? I drove by yesterday after work and is part of an outdoor discount mall located near Starbucks, and several eateries. Although very crowded, both chargers were available.

I drove by again this morning at about 6:30 AM and there was a car in one of the spots. I thought it might be an ICB but it was a Leaf. The owner happened to be walking back to his car and he told me that he can get up to 90% in about 30 minutes.

So, now I'm thinking this is very doable. I could either stop after work and hang out for 30 minutes, or, in the early morning, stop, charge and have coffee at Starbucks.

I think it's time to have another chat with the dealer in my area to see what they can do on a lease.

I've never leased a car before, always bought, but I'm thinking with the way technology moves, that it might be a detriment to own one as who knows what will develope in 3 years time.

In a different order :

- Concerning a lease : many people lease BEVs (Battery EVs) because of fear of battery state after X years, "the technology is changing so quickly", as well as the "it will only be worth 40% of purchase price after 3 years". There is a benefit to leasing, but it isn't for everybody. I, personally, am leasing my BEV (the only car I have EVER leased) but I got a GREAT price on it. Do a LOT of research and comparison shopping before signing a lease. You can easily save several thousand dollars over the course of the lease by doing your homework. Note that you will need a pretty high annual mileage rate since you will be driving about 1000 miles a month just to Carlsbad and back. There are a few threads on this site dedicated to leases - read them, and ask questions about leases there, but do your research!

- in terms of finding charging locations, go look at PlugShare.com (or download the app). Set the options to only show "CCS/SAE" and "EV plug" type connectors (the 'fast' and 'slow' format charge plugs on the bolt). Make sure you UNset the CHAdeMO type of plug. Look at all the charge spots in your areas! (Orange is the 'fast' and Green is the 'regular' speed charging). Those are the choices that exist TODAY for charging. (More DCFCs are planned to be installed over the next 4-24 months.)

- I agree with what WetEV said : charging overnight at the hotel using L2 charging stations is a much better Plan A. So is charging at work while you are there. There's much less chance you WON'T be able to charge, and you are already there - it will take *maybe* a minute total to plug and later unplug the car - no waiting for 30 minutes for the charge to complete. Start talking to the local hotels when you are there.

- Also, as already stated, the LEAF Forum owner's comments don't apply to the Bolt. The battery in a LEAF is MUCH smaller. As already pointed out, a 30-minute charge at a 50 kW station (125 Amp) should provide you with 18-22 kWh of energy, which will be enough to drive 50-90 miles on the freeway (depending on the battery "State of charge" (%), and conditions such as speed, up/down hill, strong head/tail winds, use of A/C, etc).

- Concerning the EVgo DCFCs (DC Fast Chargers) that you mentioned. If the two you are talking about are at "Carlsbad Premium outlets" then they are 50 kW chargers (125 Amp). They appear to (currently) be very under-used (as does the DCFC at the Hilton Garden Inn, which is on the ChargePoint network). A 30 minute charge at EVgo should get you 20+ kWh (if your battery starts at 35-40% at start of charge).

In closing, I'll repeat : the best solution would be to plug in for 4-10 hours at work or hotel and charge to full at a 'regular' Level-2 (L2), 240V charging station (or using your own, private portable EVSE plugged into a 240V circuit). As back up solutions, you have multiple DCFC stations along your route (including in Carlsbad) that I pointed out in an earlier post in this same thread.

 

[SeanNelson]

- I agree with what WetEV said : charging overnight at the hotel using L2 charging stations is a much better Plan A. So is charging at work while you are there.

Yep, the best charging solution isn't necessarily the fastest one. IMHO it's the one that takes the least amount of your time. A charge that occurs while you sleep or while you work doesn't take any of your time, which puts it ahead of an enroute DC fast charger that you have to wait for.

 

[iankh]

In a different order :

- Concerning a lease : many people lease BEVs (Battery EVs) because of fear of battery state after X years, "the technology is changing so quickly", as well as the "it will only be worth 40% of purchase price after 3 years". There is a benefit to leasing, but it isn't for everybody. I, personally, am leasing my BEV (the only car I have EVER leased) but I got a GREAT price on it. Do a LOT of research and comparison shopping before signing a lease. You can easily save several thousand dollars over the course of the lease by doing your homework. Note that you will need a pretty high annual mileage rate since you will be driving about 1000 miles a month just to Carlsbad and back. There are a few threads on this site dedicated to leases - read them, and ask questions about leases there, but do your research!

- in terms of finding charging locations, go look at PlugShare.com (or download the app). Set the options to only show "CCS/SAE" and "EV plug" type connectors (the 'fast' and 'slow' format charge plugs on the bolt). Make sure you UNset the CHAdeMO type of plug. Look at all the charge spots in your areas! (Orange is the 'fast' and Green is the 'regular' speed charging). Those are the choices that exist TODAY for charging. (More DCFCs are planned to be installed over the next 4-24 months.)

- I agree with what WetEV said : charging overnight at the hotel using L2 charging stations is a much better Plan A. So is charging at work while you are there. There's much less chance you WON'T be able to charge, and you are already there - it will take *maybe* a minute total to plug and later unplug the car - no waiting for 30 minutes for the charge to complete. Start talking to the local hotels when you are there.

- Also, as already stated, the LEAF Forum owner's comments don't apply to the Bolt. The battery in a LEAF is MUCH smaller. As already pointed out, a 30-minute charge at a 50 kW station (125 Amp) should provide you with 18-22 kWh of energy, which will be enough to drive 50-90 miles on the freeway (depending on the battery "State of charge" (%), and conditions such as speed, up/down hill, strong head/tail winds, use of A/C, etc).

- Concerning the EVgo DCFCs (DC Fast Chargers) that you mentioned. If the two you are talking about are at "Carlsbad Premium outlets" then they are 50 kW chargers (125 Amp). They appear to (currently) be very under-used (as does the DCFC at the Hilton Garden Inn, which is on the ChargePoint network). A 30 minute charge at EVgo should get you 20+ kWh (if your battery starts at 35-40% at start of charge).

In closing, I'll repeat : the best solution would be to plug in for 4-10 hours at work or hotel and charge to full at a 'regular' Level-2 (L2), 240V charging station (or using your own, private portable EVSE plugged into a 240V circuit). As back up solutions, you have multiple DCFC stations along your route (including in Carlsbad) that I pointed out in an earlier post in this same thread.

Thank you! I will study the thread on leasing. I have never leased a car before and obviously need to educate myself.

Sadly, there are no options to charge either while at my hotel or at work. My only option is to use a charging station, at least for now. I do intend to write to the management of the La Quinta, which is not a corporate property but a francished property. The owners own both it and the Ramada next door and steps away, to ask them if they've considered installing charging facilities that could service both properties.

 

[SparkE]

Why write? I'd ask every time you are there (since you are there every week). And start asking for the same (or better) rate at the Hilton (which already has a charger).

 

[iankh]

Took some advice here and started shopping for a lease. I've never leased a car before. I've also typically owned a car on average for 10 years. I think I found a "good" leasing price for a 15,000 per year lease. On an LT orange with DC fast charging and the comfort package. I really wanted the confidence package but I need to keep the price down.

I now a question about at home charging. In my garage I have a 3-prong dryer outlet that is not used because we have a gas dryer. Is it possible to plug into that outlet for charging. I've searched the forums but it's not really clear to me. Thanks again.

 

[user 744]

You can absolutely buy an EVSE that will plug into that socket. Have a look at https://store.clippercreek.com/inde...h&search=NEMA&category_id=74&description=true and compare plug types. Just ignore the ones that say "hardwired", and play with the amperage ratings, too.

 

[WetEV]

I now a question about at home charging. In my garage I have a 3-prong dryer outlet that is not used because we have a gas dryer. Is it possible to plug into that outlet for charging. I've searched the forums but it's not really clear to me. Thanks again.

While I could guess what this outlet was, this image might help to identify better.

I suspect that it is a NEMA 10-30, which is obsolete and should not be used. If so:

You might convert to NEMA 14-30 or NEMA 6L-30. I'd suggest an electrician, unless you know better and ignore my advice.

It also might be a NEMA 6-30.



Note that a 30 A circuit like this will support 24A maximum continuous load like charging a car.

This would require about 20 hours for an empty to full charge. Probably not a real problem, but do think about it.

https://www.clippercreek.com/does-clippercreek-offer-an-evse-that-can-plug-into-a-nema-10-30-receptacle/

https://store.clippercreek.com/level2/level2-20-to-32?product_id=121

 

[iankh]

I now a question about at home charging. In my garage I have a 3-prong dryer outlet that is not used because we have a gas dryer. Is it possible to plug into that outlet for charging. I've searched the forums but it's not really clear to me. Thanks again.

While I could guess what this outlet was, this image might help to identify better.

I suspect that it is a NEMA 10-30, which is obsolete and should not be used. If so:

You might convert to NEMA 14-30 or NEMA 6L-30. I'd suggest an electrician, unless you know better and ignore my advice.

It also might be a NEMA 6-30.



Note that a 30 A circuit like this will support 24A maximum continuous load like charging a car.

This would require about 20 hours for an empty to full charge. Probably not a real problem, but do think about it.

https://www.clippercreek.com/does-clippercreek-offer-an-evse-that-can-plug-into-a-nema-10-30-receptacle/

https://store.clippercreek.com/level2/level2-20-to-32?product_id=121

The pictures helped. The house was built in 1989 and the outlet is a NEMA 10-30.