Technology changes in 24 months

[Aidan]

http://fairreporters.net/science/why-you-shouldnt-buy-an-electric-car/

Wow the issues laid out in this article have been addressed in just 24 months

 

[SeanNelson]

http://fairreporters.net/science/why-you-shouldnt-buy-an-electric-car/

Wow the issues laid out in this article have been addressed in just 24 months

That article sounds like something from the campaign that the Koch brothers are running against electric vehicles. The fact that people are bothering to write this kind of stuff tells me that electric cars are getting close to the point at which these concerns will be history - otherwise why would they bother?

 

[sam]

I know the article is a few years old and the points made in it are archaic in comparison to how they have changed and improved the electric vehicle but it is pretty impressive how these issues really don't apply anymore

 

[Tcdn]

I think it's important to reduce our footprint and electric vehicles have come a long way to help us do that however there is a lot of details in reducing our footprint and just to say I drive an electric vehicle so I'm good to go isn't always the case there is other components to balance as well

 

[ssspinball]

I think it's important to reduce our footprint and electric vehicles have come a long way to help us do that however there is a lot of details in reducing our footprint and just to say I drive an electric vehicle so I'm good to go isn't always the case there is other components to balance as well

These studies are already done if you care to read them.

Electric vehicles already result in far less climate pollution than their gas-powered counterparts, and they’re getting cleaner. Optimizing EV production and the disposal or reuse of batteries could further increase their environmental benefits. And as electricity becomes cleaner (which it is), the difference between electric cars and gasoline cars will only grow—cementing the role of electric vehicles in halving U.S. oil use and cutting global warming emissions

If reducing your carbon footprint is your #1 goal, you should look into the i3 as BMW focused extensively on the carbon footprint of the entire production of the car right down to using only renewable energy at the plants and strange interior materials like the kenaf fiber panels and special low-impact leather dyes. Unfortunately not many people care to that extent and will just buy whatever car is cheapest. However, due to rare circumstances they actually lease at ridiculously low prices often going below $200/mo.

 

[sam]

Technology does change quickly Tesla was the first to step up n sell a standalone battery pack for energy storage banking but now Mercedes-Benz and Nissan have followed suit and also offer the same type of Technology making charging your EV almost profitable in Nissan's case if that kind of infrastructure would be developed

 

[MINK]

That is the one thing constant about technology. It'll keep changing and getting better with time. But that doesn't mean you can just wait around forever before you decide to switch to an EV.

 

[Aidan]

http://www.bloomberg.com/features/2016-ev-oil-crisis/

Here is something that will change as technology does. Bloomberg reporting an anticipated energy crisis

 

[Aidan]

Many Studies have been done in regards to efficiency of electric vehicles and emissions of electric vehicles the studies that have no conclusion because of the prediction of the future aspect is if the world becomes a globally an electric vehicle world. the footprint will not look well because we cannot control what countries like China India and parts of the US do to create energy. Using fossil fuels to create energy is a far worse pollutant than emissions from a gas powered vehicle. The key issue is the global issue not specifically state-by-state province-by-province country-by-country but globally this will not fare well for us unless the world as a whole starts using solar power wind power and other types of energy that doesn't have such a bad impact on the environment

 

[GetOffYourGas]

Using fossil fuels to create energy is a far worse pollutant than emissions from a gas powered vehicle.

There is truth in this statement, but this is a bit of a hyperbole. Burning coal in a power plant in order to charge an EV is worse than burning gasoline in an ICEV. But not "far worse". It would make my Leaf similar to a typical SUV. It's about twice that of a comparably-sized midsize car. When you say "far worse", it implies much more than 2x.

Here's an example:
http://shrinkthatfootprint.com/electric-cars-green

Look at the second picture comparing electric cars versus gasoline. The electric cars are charged with the current grid mix. The MPG of a comparable gasoline car is given. The worst grid on the map is in India. There, an electric car is equivalent to a gasser getting 20MPG. Not good, but a bit of a stretch to say it is "far worse". Many many cars get less than 20MPG.

In the US, the equivalent is 40MPG. That's worse than a Prius, but better than most gas cars. Again, you cannot call this "far worse".

Now the part we both absolutely agree on is the need to clean up the grid. These numbers will improve as the grid improves. In many areas, it is far better than the average. Here in upstate NY, we have mostly hydro and nuclear power. An EV charged from our grid is better than a gas car getting 100 MPG. And we have "green-up" options. I buy exclusively wind power from the grid to supplement the small PV array on my roof. These technologies are at a tipping point. PV is already cheaper than the grid, but you have to pay upfront. It is starting to catch on, and will likely grow very quickly in the near future.

 

[Tcdn]

I think it's important to reduce our footprint and electric vehicles have come a long way to help us do that however there is a lot of details in reducing our footprint and just to say I drive an electric vehicle so I'm good to go isn't always the case there is other components to balance as well

These studies are already done if you care to read them.

Electric vehicles already result in far less climate pollution than their gas-powered counterparts, and they’re getting cleaner. Optimizing EV production and the disposal or reuse of batteries could further increase their environmental benefits. And as electricity becomes cleaner (which it is), the difference between electric cars and gasoline cars will only grow—cementing the role of electric vehicles in halving U.S. oil use and cutting global warming emissions

If reducing your carbon footprint is your #1 goal, you should look into the i3 as BMW focused extensively on the carbon footprint of the entire production of the car right down to using only renewable energy at the plants and strange interior materials like the kenaf fiber panels and special low-impact leather dyes. Unfortunately not many people care to that extent and will just buy whatever car is cheapest. However, due to rare circumstances they actually lease at ridiculously low prices often going below $200/mo.

Well luckily I do read and have read them however we are talking globally not just first nation countries of North America and Europe. Asia is not as concerned about pollution in all its forms as other countries are. Those are facts so I repeat let's keep on the manufacturers to keep improving their products from start to finish so we all don't become blind to some not so great facts happening in other parts of the world. In short I hope you care to read everything out there and not just pick and chose what suits your agenda

 

[SparkE]

Well, anyone who owns their home (in the US) can choose to put enough photovoltaic panels on their roof to generate the electricity that they use. That is pretty clean energy.

I've been thinking about it for a while, but it would take me about 30 years to break even (I use VERY little electricity). If I could buy the panels wholesale and put them up myself, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

 

[GetOffYourGas]

Well, anyone who owns their home (in the US) can choose to put enough photovoltaic panels on their roof to generate the electricity that they use. That is pretty clean energy.

I've been thinking about it for a while, but it would take me about 30 years to break even (I use VERY little electricity). If I could buy the panels wholesale and put them up myself, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

Be careful when making broad, sweeping statements. For example, I do have solar panels on my roof, but they only generate about 1/3 of my annual usage. The only way for me to generate enough electricity to run my home for a family of 4, while charging our two electric cars, is to cut down some of my neighbors' trees.

Also, I'm not sure why the amount of energy you use would make it take longer to break even? If you use less, you need a smaller (cheaper) array. For the most part, the cost scales pretty linearly with array size. A much bigger factor is your electric rate and local climate. I'm in cloudy upstate NY, with long, snow-covered winters (read: practically zero production from Dec-Feb) and average electric costs (~$0.11/kWh). I am at about my 5-year anniversary, and I've made back half the cost of the array in savings. Break-even for me is looking like just under 10 years.

 

[wwhitney]

Also, I'm not sure why the amount of energy you use would make it take longer to break even?

Fixed costs independent of system size--minimum permit fees, overhead of doing all the paperwork, the contractor's mobilization-demobilization costs, etc.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[GetOffYourGas]

Also, I'm not sure why the amount of energy you use would make it take longer to break even?

Fixed costs independent of system size--minimum permit fees, overhead of doing all the paperwork, the contractor's mobilization-demobilization costs, etc.

Cheers, Wayne

I understand there are fixed costs, but in my experience, they are much smaller than the per-kW cost. I had multiple sized systems quoted when I had mine done, and all were very similar in overall price per kW. Maybe in different regions, these costs are higher?

 

[Anonymous]

I do read and have read them however we are talking globally not just first nation countries of North America and Europe. Asia is not as concerned about pollution in all its forms as other countries are. Those are facts

You seem to use the word "fact" when you mean "sweeping generalization".

See this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhIZ50HKIp0

300 million views in 4 days as per:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Under_the_Dome_(film)

Asia is very concerned. But just like here in North America, political and industrial interests restrict progress.

 

[ssspinball]

Asia is not as concerned about pollution in all its forms as other countries are. Those are facts so I repeat let's keep on the manufacturers to keep improving their products from start to finish so we all don't become blind to some not so great facts happening in other parts of the world. In short I hope you care to read everything out there and not just pick and chose what suits your agenda

I would ask that you take your own advice here as China in particular is very quickly passing the US when it comes to actions taken to address environmental issues and now the US President-Elect is considering promoting a climate-change denier to his cabinet among other detrimental actions like more drilling, more coal, etc.