Range, real world use case, etc.

[Zoomit]

Does anyone know if Chevy will provide chargers at dealerships? Seems like an obvious thing to do.

Because you always want to go to a Chevy dealer?? I would need to be paid to go sit in a Chevy dealer for 30-90 min everytime I need to charge.

200 miles will be sufficient for most people for "local" driving. It isn't alone sufficient for long distance travel, where you need fast charging at intermittent stops along the route. This is exactly how the Tesla Supercharger network is designed.

 

[roundpeg]

I'm mostly not thrilled by dealership provided charging stations. Often business hours only, sometimes very nice, sometimes "our make only" sometimes "if you bought it here only", sometimes just nasty. I'd rather see at destinations, at restaurants and other reasonable stopping points like malls...

If Chevy dealership did offer chargers, it would be mainly to provide Bolt owners with an additional safety net. It would certainly be a easy way for them to leverage their large national dealership network, something Tesla lacks. Seems to me it would be foolish for them not to.

Sure, ideally charging stations are well distributed, especially at places you want to stop. That seems to be more in the realm of possibility as EVs become more popular. We probably have a better chance of seeing this happen in CA than elsewhere in the country.

Either way, it sure looks like I need to learn an entirely new language!

 

[Anonymous]

If Chevy dealership did offer chargers, it would be mainly to provide Bolt owners with an additional safety net. It would certainly be a easy way for them to leverage their large national dealership network, something Tesla lacks. Seems to me it would be foolish for them not to

Dealers are generally poorly placed, they are generally in one small area of a city (car alley type deal) and wouldn't offer the kind of routes necessary for road trip charging. Tesla superchargers are conveniently placed with restaurants and rest rooms accessible 7 days per week, usually a few minutes detour off major highway routes.

And Tesla does deliberately not use dealerships, as dealerships are not in the business of supporting electric car infrastructure, and are closed on weekends, and have a financial model where they need to make money by servicing vehicles, whereas Tesla has set up their service centers to avoid profit, run at the cost to maintain the cars, and no more.

 

[SeanNelson]

Dealers are generally poorly placed, they are generally in one small area of a city (car alley type deal) and wouldn't offer the kind of routes necessary for road trip charging.

Most dealers are poorly placed, but there's usually at least one or two (or even more in a large metropolitan area) that are next to something like a shopping mall or transit. Not all dealers necessarily need to offer chargers.

The idea wouldn't be to duplicate the Tesla network, it would be to use one of Chevy's supposed biggest advantages - its dealer network - to plug some of the worst holes in the fast charger infrastructure so that the PlugShare map would give Bolt owners confidence instead of worries.

 

[SeanNelson]

Dealers are generally poorly placed, they are generally in one small area of a city (car alley type deal) and wouldn't offer the kind of routes necessary for road trip charging.

Most dealers are poorly placed, but there's usually at least one or two (or even more in a large metropolitan area) that are next to something like a shopping mall or transit. Not all dealers necessarily need to offer chargers.

The idea wouldn't be to duplicate the Tesla network, it would be to use one of Chevy's supposed biggest advantages - its dealer network - to plug some of the worst holes in the fast charger infrastructure so that the PlugShare map would give Bolt owners confidence instead of doubts.

 

[roundpeg]

The idea wouldn't be to duplicate the Tesla network, it would be to use one of Chevy's supposed biggest advantages - its dealer network - to plug some of the worst holes in the fast charger infrastructure so that the PlugShare map would give Bolt owners confidence instead of worries.

Yes, that's my thinking. In CA at least most car dealers are clustered within auto-malls right next to freeways. Chevy would be nuts not to turn most of them into charging stations for Bolt owners. They are going to need them anyway if they going to be selling the cars.

 

[DucRider]

The idea wouldn't be to duplicate the Tesla network, it would be to use one of Chevy's supposed biggest advantages - its dealer network - to plug some of the worst holes in the fast charger infrastructure so that the PlugShare map would give Bolt owners confidence instead of worries.

Yes, that's my thinking. In CA at least most car dealers are clustered within auto-malls right next to freeways. Chevy would be nuts not to turn most of them into charging stations for Bolt owners. They are going to need them anyway if they going to be selling the cars.

Dealers will not need Fast Chargers to sell the Bolt, and most dealer charging is located on their property and available only during business hours. They tend to discourage people wandering their lots after hours (most are gated and/or blocked by vehicles).

 

[WetEV]

Dealers will not need Fast Chargers to sell the Bolt, and most dealer charging is located on their property and available only during business hours. They tend to discourage people wandering their lots after hours (most are gated and/or blocked by vehicles).

To sell, no, unless the demo car gets used enough to need a DCQC.

To service, perhaps. Otherwise, suppose someone comes in with a car that is failing when using a DCQC? How do they verify the problem and the fix?

 

[Zoomit]

Chevy dealers currently sell Spark EVs with DCFC and aren't required to have those chargers. Some thing for BMW. Anyone know if Tesla Service Centers have Superchargers for maintenance technician use?

 

[Diggle]

Hi all, new to the forum, and new to real BEVs (though I do own a LEV, not sure that counts!).

Much to my own surprise, I am seriously considering the Bolt to replace my 13-year-old gas burner. My use case is probably a bit different than usual so I was hoping I could run it past some experienced EV owners to get a better feel for whether I am a good candidate for one of these cars.

I do not commute. I work at home. I tend to drive under 5,000/year. With the exception below, most of this is local driving (around town, and under 50 miles round trip). So no issues there.

But when I do need to drive longer distances, the trips are often into the big city, about 65 miles away, minimum. You might see where I am going with this. Round trips not much under the 200 range seem bound to create the dreaded range anxiety. More likely than not, these trips will not be to places where I could stop for long enough to recharge (even assuming I found a charger, another issue).

A related question: on a hot day (running the AC) or at night (lights on), how much range reduction can be expected? Would I be nuts to attempt a 150 round trip in an EV mainly at freeway speeds on a hot day, with a return at night?

We have two cars. The other can be used for cross-country travel. The idea would be to use the EV for pretty much everything else.

What do you think?

Thanks!

Welcome to the forum. Bolt EV has an excellent range so your 150 kms round trip should be perfectly possible.

 

[Anonymous]

Anyone know if Tesla Service Centers have Superchargers for maintenance technician use?

Yes. The primary Tesla service center in Toronto Ontario and the one in Montreal Quebec both have superchargers, and use them daily for charging customer cars and testing.

 

[ssspinball]

I've had an EV for a year. I think the Bolt would easily work for your situation.

Also you do not want to depend on dealers for charging. Trust me.

 

[roundpeg]

I've had an EV for a year. I think the Bolt would easily work for your situation.

Also you do not want to depend on dealers for charging. Trust me.

Depend on them? No, of course not, but more options are better than fewer. Chevy is marketing this car as "the EV for the rest of us" so whatever they can do to build a comfort zone for first-timers would be to their benefit, and the dealer network is an advantage they've got over Tesla. I'd expect them to take advantage of it.

 

[Zoomit]

Depend on them? No, of course not, but more options are better than fewer.

My limited experience with chargers is that if I can't depend on them being available and functional, then they are virtually useless. More options are not necessarily better than fewer if those options are unreliable. They can lead you to make driving decisions that can leave you stranded, or at least causing delays or change your plans.

A 200-mi range EV doesn't need much in terms of recharging station network "around town", assuming the owner has the ability to charge it at home.

For long distance travel, an EV needs a charging network that is, in priority order, 1) located close to the long distance routes, 2) reliable and 3) high power.

 

[roundpeg]

My limited experience with chargers is that if I can't depend on them being available and functional, then they are virtually useless. More options are not necessarily better than fewer if those options are unreliable. They can lead you to make driving decisions that can leave you stranded, or at least causing delays or change your plans.

A 200-mi range EV doesn't need much in terms of recharging station network "around town", assuming the owner has the ability to charge it at home.

For long distance travel, an EV needs a charging network that is, in priority order, 1) located close to the long distance routes, 2) reliable and 3) high power.

You may see earlier in this thread I asked about the reliability and accessibility of chargers, as this is a concern to me. I could be wrong but I suspect chargers at Chevy dealers would be more reliable and accessible than chargers in parking garages. Obviously 200 miles is plenty of range for "around town" (in my case, it would suffice for two weeks of around town). What I was asking about was not necessarily long-distance routes but the practicality of planning round trips at 70-80% of the car's rated range.

 

[DucRider]

You may see earlier in this thread I asked about the reliability and accessibility of chargers, as this is a concern to me. I could be wrong but I suspect chargers at Chevy dealers would be more reliable and accessible than chargers in parking garages. Obviously 200 miles is plenty of range for "around town" (in my case, it would suffice for two weeks of around town). What I was asking about was not necessarily long-distance routes but the practicality of planning round trips at 70-80% of the car's rated range.

Most dealership chargers are inaccessible during non-business hours, and if you're talking Fast Charging, you generally don't see that in parking garages except in dense urban areas with no free or street parking. In those areas, dealers are not likely a viable option. If you're talking L2 charging, hanging out at a dealership for an hour or two (9 for a full charge) would not be my first choice.

From your original post:

But when I do need to drive longer distances, the trips are often into the big city, about 65 miles away, minimum. You might see where I am going with this. Round trips not much under the 200 range seem bound to create the dreaded range anxiety. More likely than not, these trips will not be to places where I could stop for long enough to recharge (even assuming I found a charger, another issue).

A related question: on a hot day (running the AC) or at night (lights on), how much range reduction can be expected? Would I be nuts to attempt a 150 round trip in an EV mainly at freeway speeds on a hot day, with a return at night?

Range anxiety varies from person to person. My wife has been known to stop to charge ~1 mile from home with 10 miles of range remaining because the "low charge" warning came on :?

As to the related question, AC and lights generally don't have a huge impact on range. Cold temps - dense air, need for heat, reduced battery efficiency, etc have a much greater impact. These loads are also more time than distance related. And you also need to define "freeway speed". 55 mph? 70 mph? more?

On a 90 degree day, on relatively flat terrain, at 60 mph, I would expect the Bolt to make that 150 mile round trip with ease.

 

[WetEV]

On a 90 degree day, on relatively flat terrain, at 60 mph, I would expect the Bolt to make that 150 mile round trip with ease.

No wind as well.

 

[roundpeg]

As to the related question, AC and lights generally don't have a huge impact on range. Cold temps - dense air, need for heat, reduced battery efficiency, etc have a much greater impact. These loads are also more time than distance related. And you also need to define "freeway speed". 55 mph? 70 mph? more?

On a 90 degree day, on relatively flat terrain, at 60 mph, I would expect the Bolt to make that 150 mile round trip with ease.

Not to repeat anything I've said or asked already but to summarize, for out-of-area trips we are talking Southern California freeways and HOV lanes. I am personally perfectly happy to not drive over 65, but hanging out in the HOV lane going less than 75 is considered to be a crime pushable by death in these parts. You will be tailgated, or worse. Given those constraints I believe the consensus was a 20-30% penalty from EPA range rating to something closer to 140-50 miles.

 

[voltage]

Range anxiety is a big issue for me

 

[Zoomit]

Given those constraints I believe the consensus was a 20-30% penalty from EPA range rating to something closer to 140-50 miles.

I have calculated that my highway penalty is 14%, based on 7,000 miles of a commute that is mostly (75%) highway. That 14% EXCLUDES the energy used for HVAC or battery conditioning. So a 20-30% knockdown is a good guess.