2018 Honda Clarity : BEV, PHEV, and fuel cell

[SparkE]

Looks like Honda is also going the "Ioniq" route : a model that is ONLY eco-friendly, with multiple models/drive-trains.

They announced their 2018 Clarity, which will have all-electric, plug-in hybrid, and fuel cell models. (All presumably available in late 2017.)

The range on the BEV is somewhat disappointing (80-ish miles), but the PHEV is supposed to have an impressive over-40 mile electric range. I haven't read too deeply into it, so I am not sure if the PHEV is more a "traditional" hybrid, or more a i3-type (basically all-electric propulsion with a gas engine as range extender). Surprisingly, this Japanese manufacturer will be selling the Clarity with a CCS fast-charge port, and not CHAdeMO!

The Clarity appears to be positioned as an upscale, mid-sized sedan - their eco Accord, so to speak. The all-electric and fuel cell models will only be offered in CA (and OR?), but the PHEV will be available in all 50 states.

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1103535_2018-honda-clarity-electric-versions-first-details-including-40-plus-mile-range-for-plug-in-hybrid

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1109866_honda-clarity-electric-plug-in-hybrid-sedans-revealed-at-ny-auto-show

http://www.caranddriver.com/news/2018-honda-clarity-electric-and-plug-in-hybrid-photos-and-info-news

 

[Nagorak]

The Honda Clarity PHEV looks interesting, although I consider 40 miles of range to still be a bit on the low side (still way better than the Prius Prime, of course). I have a hard time seeing why I'd choose a Clarity PHEV over a Volt, unless its gas mileage proves to be much better. With the EV though, 80 miles of range seems pretty poor at this point. If they'd come out with it 3 years ago it would have fared better.

All the same, it's nice to see Honda at least sticking its toe in the water.

 

[GetOffYourGas]

The PHEV is the only Clarity worth talking about at this point. The other two are simply an experiment by Honda.

The car looks very much like a mid-sized Honda sedan (i.e. Accord). I hope it does well. 40 miles really is a sweet spot for range; above that and there are diminishing returns. Above 60 just really makes no sense. This will work for many people. Heck, the 19 miles in my Energi work great for me, although I recognize that it is far too little for many others. It's good to have variety.

As for why you'd buy this over a Volt? The Volt is a compact, the Clarity is mid-sized. That alone is a strong reason. There are also many people who would buy a car with an "H" on the front over a bowtie any day (I used to be one, but not any more).

 

[SparkE]

"Why buy the Clarity over a Volt? "

One reason is that one simply prefers the Clarity to the Volt - all the 'personal' reasons. Size and "Cachet"/"Reliability" ("I prefer a Honda") have been mentioned, but there *could* be : finish (interior 'quality' or 'feel'), appointments (collision avoidance, auto-braking, better mobile app, style/setup of infotainment), other options not available on Volt), visibility, the car's 'look' (which is very personal), color choices, seating comfort/legroom, etc., etc.

And, of course, the Clarity might have a built-in GPS system - which for some people is so important as to (almost) be a deal-breaker!! :roll:

My next 'ICE' vehicle will most likely be a plug-in hybrid. I want a minimum of 30 miles electric range (I may go down to 27 or 28, but grudgingly). One of us in the family will (generally) only drive 20 miles or so in the day, while the other will take the BEV (range 80-130 on freeway, most likely). And the PHEV will be the 'travel car' - the one we take on road trips (so I can get rid of my older ICE vehicle, which barely serves, currently). My other 'personal need' is that the gas engine must be a low polluter - comparable to (say) a standard Toyota Prius or Honda Civic hybrid (or better). A higher pollution Range Extender vehicle wouldn't work for me, as this would be the 'go to' vehicle for our road trips. A 'want' would be a hatchback, because we occasionally haul a kitchen table or set of chairs, or wine fridge, or buy a TV - and our Ford Focus fits that bill just fine (with rear seats folded down).

A number of auto manufacturers are blowing the "we want a large % of our cars to be electric before 20X0" horn. Honda is saying so (made announcements), as have others. A bunch of plug-in vehicles (either pure electric, or hybrids) should be hitting the market in the next few years. Kia/Hyundai (similar to GM/Chevy/Buick/...) have already announced quite a few. There's already the Ioniq, Sonata, Soul, Optima, and Nero, and the newly announced "Stonic". The VW conglomerate is also making similar noises, but with fewer solid announcements so far (or at least not ones that I am aware of). As well as other manufacturers. It looks like non- 'conformance' vehicles will be available from quite a few manufacturers soon. I am looking forward to test driving them.

 

[Nagorak]

Yeah, a lot of car manufacturers are making noises, but they're going to have to get serious pretty quickly. That includes bringing their dealers up to speed. I looked at an e-Golf today (unfortunately only a 2016, but with a really aggressive lease deal), and the salesman seemed like he just couldn't have cared less about selling it. Not that it matters because the price sells itself. If the Clarity EV was available for a good price, I'd consider it also, but it's not available yet. In the end I couldn't bring myself to pull the trigger on the Bolt-- the price just wasn't right.

 

[LeftieBiker]

My other 'personal need' is that the gas engine must be a low polluter - comparable to (say) a standard Honda Prius (or better).

You mean an Insight? Anyway, I'm not sure that choosing a Honda BEV or PHEV for reliability is wise, because Honda has been having problems with their battery packs since the Civic Hybrid was introduced. The Fit seems to be doing better, but overall Honda's track record on battery packs is equal to or worse than Nissan's...

 

[SparkE]

I actually meant Toyota Prius (which has a very efficient, low polluting gasoline engine). I changed my post (thanks for the catch!) and also added Honda Civic hybrid (which is efficient as well).

If anybody can point me at data/an article that shows the pollution levels emitted by the GASOLINE portion of hybrid vehicles (or even better - PHEVs), I'd appreciate it. Especially if there were comparisons to vehicles like a standard Corolla or Civic or Ford Focus or ...

 

[boltage]

If anybody can point me at data/an article that shows the pollution levels emitted by the GASOLINE portion of hybrid vehicles (or even better - PHEVs), I'd appreciate it. Especially if there were comparisons to vehicles like a standard Corolla or Civic or Ford Focus or ...

If you are referring to the HC, CO, NOx emissions of hybrid gasoline engine vehicles, you can check their emissions certification, just like with non-hybrid gasoline engine vehicles. Some vehicles may be offered in multiple emissions certifications. You can look these up on http://www.fueleconomy.gov .

 

[SparkE]

The Honda Clarity PHEV is now on sale, as has really hit the ground running. The figures for BEV/PHEV are combined, but the BEV has been available since July and the PHEV's first availability was in Nov.

Sales (BEV + PHEV) :
Oct : 34
Nov : 364
Dec : 1425

The Clarity PHEV's electric range is announced as ... 47 miles.

 

[DucRider]

If anybody can point me at data/an article that shows the pollution levels emitted by the GASOLINE portion of hybrid vehicles (or even better - PHEVs), I'd appreciate it. Especially if there were comparisons to vehicles like a standard Corolla or Civic or Ford Focus or ...

Like this?

Did these for our spec sheets for the 2017 Portland Auto Show for pretty much everything on the market last year. I am in the process of updating the spec sheets for this years show, but we dropped the "Well to Wheels" info as it is no longer a top priority for those moving to EV's (and a bit confusing without someone to explain the graphic).

You can compare the Clarity PHEV to the Accord (or anything else) here:
https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find.do?action=sbs&id=39782&id=39595&#tab2
Calculate emissions for the Clarity PHEV (or any EV) here:
https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find.do?zipCode=97223&year=2018&vehicleId=39782&action=bt3
Customize with your zip code to calculate Electricity GHG from your local grid mix.
I you read the explanation below the numbers, it gives the assumed electricty/gas mix on PHEV's based on electric range.
The Prime is calculated as 53% electric, the Clarity PHEV 73%, etc.

 

[AyeJay]

I drove the Clarity FCEV fuel cell 8 months ago and the Clarity BEV 3 months ago.
Both are what I consider luxury passenger sedans.

The FCEV version was good but lacked any battery capacity (1.7kW?). The car makes electricity for the drive motor on-demand from hydrogen gas. Consequently the performance in both acceleration and re-generative braking was weak IMO.

The Clarity BEV had better response although the strength of the regenerative braking was minimal. The battery capacity of (25.5-kW) is inadequate for an electric only car IMO.

The Clarity platform is ripe to be a combination of the two above options.. an FCEV/BEV Hybird! ..

Until a 'dual fuel' Clarity EV with a 25.5-kW battery pack AND a fuel cell range extender becomes an option i don't see either of these two cars selling well.

-- On the other hand If/When a FCEV/BEV plugin hybrid comes to market from Honda or anyone else I expect runaway sales.

AJ

 

[SparkE]

DucR - the image doesn't show up for me.

The problem with the linked sites is that it :

- shows "electricity + gas" for PHEVs and I want to know what the gas engine produces all by itself, as if I were driving at 60 mph on the freeway and using just the gas engine.

- shows "greenhouse gas" (CO2). It's pretty easy to compare GHG : look at the mileage. I am interested in seeing ALL pollutants from the gas engine.

 

[gpsman]

The Clarity BEV has leases for $199/mo.

The Clarity PHEV that I really want has leases for $499/mo.

This makes the decisions so difficult.