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GetOffYourGas said:
LeftieBiker said:
I'd also be a bit concerned about someone building 240 volt devices but seems to think that they are 220 volts...

The difference is pretty trivial - you do it the same way. The truth is, they used to be 220V, a few decades ago. The power companies bumped them up to 240 without changing a thing, because everything was already built to handle 250V or more. They decided that reducing the headroom from 30V to 10V was a tolerable risk.

The terms "220V" and "110V" are used so often simply for historical reasons. They were used for so long, that they simply have stuck around. So someone calling it 220V when it's technically 240V is really a non issue.

BTW, the voltage on a "240V" circuit can easily drop below 220V under heavy load. A friend of mine in Buffalo regularly sees less than 200V in the summer when all of his neighbors turn on their whole-house A/Cs.

I agree with this 100%. When I was much younger it was 110 and 220. I still use these numbers because that is what I grew up with. Anyone who thinks 10 and 20 volts AC, respectively, will make a difference, shouldn't be working with elctricity.
 
JeffreyDV said:
Anyone who thinks 10 and 20 volts AC, respectively, will make a difference, shouldn't be working with elctricity.
...especially when you consider that even the "correct" values of 120 and 240V are really just conventions. The actual peak voltage of the A/C waveform is actually higher than that, 120 and 240 are just the "average" (actually, RMS) values of the sine wave.
 
I guess I should stop working with elctricity, then! My point was that the builder of these devices should know the US voltage standard that has been in place since before the end of the last century. There was no good reason to label them according to a common misconception, so I suspect a certain lack of deep expertise. Given the dubious safety of the device, that actually makes sense.

It was 110/220 volts when I grew up, too. Somehow I was able to process the change.
 
If you have two out of phase 120v circuits then you have one 240v circuit and you don't need a power converter box or anything!

That box is not needed, unless you want to very infrequently use 240v and most frequently want to use 120v.

I have 20 amp 120v circuits available.

I'd be happy if I could charge at 16A, or 18A on my 120 volts. The 12 amp setting is getting me by if I don't use A/C or much heat in the car. Those 100 degrees days when I was using A/C I could not quite refill overnight what I used the day before @ 12A 120V.

I few more amps at 120V would be ideal for me.

Anyone know how to do this?
 
LeftieBiker said:
I guess I should stop working with elctricity, then! My point was that the builder of these devices should know the US voltage standard that has been in place since before the end of the last century. There was no good reason to label them according to a common misconception, so I suspect a certain lack of deep expertise. Given the dubious safety of the device, that actually makes sense.

It was 110/220 volts when I grew up, too. Somehow I was able to process the change.
From their website:

Diamond H Company LLC, doing business as Quick 220 Electrical Systems, was formed in Arizona in 1994 to develop the concepts embodied in the Quick 220 Voltage Converting Power Supply. The first model was made available to the public and sold in 1998. In 1999, United States Patent 5,977,658 was issued covering the safety circuit employed within the Quick 220 Power Supply.

Maybe that is why 20th Century FOX hasn't changed the name of its movie subsidiary, even though we are in the 21st Century. Their brand is more important to them than it is to you.
 
http://www.straightdope.com/columns...lectricity-not-240-like-the-rest-of-the-world

How come the U.S. uses 120 volt electricity, not 240 like the rest of the world?
November 20, 1992

Dear Cecil:

How come the U.S. is practically the only country in the world where household electricity is 110 volts instead of 220 volts?

— Mark, Berkeley, California

Cecil replies:

The penalty of leadership, champ. While inventors in many countries contributed to electric power technology, the U.S. was way out front in putting that technology to practical use. In the early days, lower voltages were the most practical for electric lights — higher voltages burned out the bulbs. So the hundreds of power plants built in the U.S. prior to 1900 adopted 110 volts (or 115 or 120 volts) as their de facto standard.

Trouble was, power transmission at higher voltages was more efficient — you didn't have to use so much copper in the wires. By the time most European countries got around to making big time investments in electricity, the engineers had figured out how to make 220-volt bulbs that wouldn't burn out so fast. So, starting in Germany around the turn of the century, they adopted the 220-volt (or 230- or 240-volt) standard. But the U.S. stayed with 110 volts (today it's officially 120 volts) because we had such a big installed base of 110-volt equipment.

But don't worry that we're stuck with a technological dinosaur. Fact is, homes with standard 3-wire electrical service in most parts of the country get 240 volts. The three wires that come in from the street are 120 volts positive, zero volts (neutral), and 120 volts negative. (I know, this is alternating current, not DC, so we can't really say "120 volts positive," but don't bother me with details.)

Take the neutral and either of the other wires (the usual practice) and you've got 120 volts. But tap into your plus-120 and minus-120 and you'll get a 240-volt jolt, handy for energy-hungry appliances like air conditioners or electric stoves and clothes dryers. The telltale sign in the fusebox is a special double-width circuit breaker that straddles the plus-120 and minus-120 bus bars. Not the most vital fact in the world, but at least next time you're poking around in there when the lights blow you'll have some idea what you're looking at.
Static

Dear Cecil:

Are you going to explain to your readers that, with the three-phase wiring prevalent in the world, the two lines are only 120 degrees apart in phase, and not of opposite polarity as you stated? And that therefore tapping across them provides only 208 volts, not 240? Or do you figure nobody will miss the other 32 volts AC? And that explaining three-phase polarity isn't worth the space, justifying your fudge?

— Robert Goodman, Bronx, New York

Cecil replies:

Sarcasm plays better when you have at least a general idea what you're talking about, Robert. Three-phase power is used primarily in commercial applications, not homes. When I was an electrician's apprentice, I remember we installed it in a garment factory for use with portable electric cloth cutters. The electrical service in most U.S. homes is 240 volts single phase with a center tap, giving you the 120 volts needed for most household uses. To be fair, New York, in this as so many things, is an exception. There 208 volts is the standard high-end voltage.

— Cecil Adams
 
LeftieBiker said:
Given the dubious safety of the device, that actually makes sense.
Says you! They've been selling this device for many years with many satisfied customers...

If you have any evidence of its "dubious safety" record other than the fact you don't like their name, let's hear it now!

LeftieBiker said:
November 20, 1992

Dear Cecil:

How come the U.S. is practically the only country in the world where household electricity is 110 volts instead of 220 volts?

— Mark, Berkeley, California
If the US was still using 110 volts in 1992, using two out of phase circuits would double that to:

2 x 110 volts = 220 volts!

Hence a device that connects two out of phase 110 volt circuits in 1992 would be called "Quick220"

AGAIN: It's THEIR brandname, not YOURS!

So, if you don't like the way they name their device, you don't need to disparage it as well for that reason...
 
gpsman said:
I few more amps at 120V would be ideal for me.

Anyone know how to do this?
I have not found found a way to pump 120 volts into the Bolt EV at higher than 12 amps! I do not think it is possible.

For that reason, I finally brought a 240v 30 amp line into my garage so I could use my Clipper Creek LCS-25p (that has been collecting dust since I purchased it for my old Chevy Volt days) and have been very happy with its results compared to 120v/12 amps!
 
Another reason I continue to use the term "220" is because 220 is 240 only in residential areas. In commercial and industrial areas, with three phase power, 220 means 208.


By the way, two weeks ago there was a super heat wave in Southern California. My residential 220 was all the way down to 200. My air conditioner wouldn't start up. I called the DWP and they said, "yeah...."
 
michaellax said:
LeftieBiker said:
Given the dubious safety of the device, that actually makes sense.
Says you! They've been selling this device for many years with many satisfied customers...

If you have any evidence of its "dubious safety" record other than the fact you don't like their name, let's hear it now!

LeftieBiker said:
November 20, 1992

Dear Cecil:

How come the U.S. is practically the only country in the world where household electricity is 110 volts instead of 220 volts?

— Mark, Berkeley, California
If the US was still using 110 volts in 1992, using two out of phase circuits would double that to:

2 x 110 volts = 220 volts!

Hence a device that connects two out of phase 110 volt circuits in 1992 would be called "Quick220"

AGAIN: It's THEIR brandname, not YOURS!

So, if you don't like the way they name their device, you don't need to disparage it as well for that reason...

Cropping to remove the relevant point is just sad. You're now filtered.

Fact is, homes with standard 3-wire electrical service in most parts of the country get 240 volts.
 
LeftieBiker said:
michaellax said:
LeftieBiker said:
Given the dubious safety of the device, that actually makes sense.
Says you! They've been selling this device for many years with many satisfied customers...

If you have any evidence of its "dubious safety" record other than the fact you don't like their name, let's hear it now!
So, apparently, the only evidence that you have of your claim that the device is of "dubious safety" is your dislike of their product name.

That is not only really sad, but trade disparagement, too!
 
michaellax said:
gpsman said:
I few more amps at 120V would be ideal for me.

Anyone know how to do this?
I have not found found a way to pump 120 volts into the Bolt EV at higher than 12 amps! I do not think it is possible.

For that reason, I finally brought a 240v 30 amp line into my garage so I could use my Clipper Creek LCS-25p (that has been collecting dust since I purchased it for my old Chevy Volt days) and have been very happy with its results compared to 120v/12 amps!

That is because the Bolt apparently will not request more than 12A on 120V, regardless of the EVSE being able to advertise more than 12A available. If someone has a 16A 120V EVSE (they exist), they could try charging the Bolt, but I suspect it won't request more than 12A.
 
gpsman said:
I have 20 amp 120v circuits available.

I'd be happy if I could charge at 16A, or 18A on my 120 volts. The 12 amp setting is getting me by if I don't use A/C or much heat in the car. Those 100 degrees days when I was using A/C I could not quite refill overnight what I used the day before @ 12A 120V.

I few more amps at 120V would be ideal for me.

Anyone know how to do this?

If you have 20 amp circuits, I'm assuming you have #10 wire. Check local code but you should be good for up to 30 amps. All you probably need to do is wire up a NEMA 14-30 outlet, get an adapter for your EVSE, and you're in business.
 
NeilBlanchard said:
Here's another way to do this:

http://www.quick220.com/220_catalog/voltage-converters.html

A220-20D-thumb.jpg
I almost purchased the Quick220 to go with my AV TurboCord, so that I would have more 240 options, but in my experience with my 240 adapters I almost always have a 240 outlet available to me when I need it. So I decided to forgo the extra expense.
 
oilerlord said:
gpsman said:
I have 20 amp 120v circuits available.

I'd be happy if I could charge at 16A, or 18A on my 120 volts. The 12 amp setting is getting me by if I don't use A/C or much heat in the car. Those 100 degrees days when I was using A/C I could not quite refill overnight what I used the day before @ 12A 120V.

I few more amps at 120V would be ideal for me.

Anyone know how to do this?

If you have 20 amp circuits, I'm assuming you have #10 wire. Check local code but you should be good for up to 30 amps. All you probably need to do is wire up a NEMA 14-30 outlet, get an adapter for your EVSE, and you're in business.
If you try this, remember to remove any other outlets on the circuit or you'll wind up with 240 V NEMA 15's that will make life a little more interesting than you'd probably like when you plug something in.
And house wiring in the US will almost universally have #14 on 15A and #12 on 20A . You'll also wind up with wire nut junctions at every removed outlet that will increase the resistance and voltage drop on your run. Be very sure there are no loose/poor connections at those wire nuts as the continuous load of an EVSE will have more potential for excess heat at mechanical connections.
 
DucRider said:
If you try this, remember to remove any other outlets on the circuit or you'll wind up with 240 V NEMA 15's that will make life a little more interesting than you'd probably like when you plug something in.
And house wiring in the US will almost universally have #14 on 15A and #12 on 20A . You'll also wind up with wire nut junctions at every removed outlet that will increase the resistance and voltage drop on your run. Be very sure there are no loose/poor connections at those wire nuts as the continuous load of an EVSE will have more potential for excess heat at mechanical connections.

Thank you! A former (or current) electrician (or electrical engineer?)
 
DucRider said:
If you try this, remember to remove any other outlets on the circuit or you'll wind up with 240 V NEMA 15's that will make life a little more interesting than you'd probably like when you plug something in.

Thanks for pointing that out, Gary. I should have realized he probably has multiple outlets strung on the same circuit that now become 240v -
which introduces the element of danger if they aren't removed. Brings up another point that the layman should avoid doing this stuff, especially when the main consideration seems to be the pursuit of the lowest cost solution.
 
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