Special Charging rates for Bolt Owners

[mwk]

So here's a question for Chevrolet, and I apologize if this has already been asked (but I didn't see it in this forum). Why doesn't Chevrolet offer special charging rates for public charging, such as Nissan and BMW offer? It really seems as if GM is producing this car only because it's forced to, kicking and screaming.

 

[SparkE]

Personally, I am *glad* that Chevy is not giving away those cards. I hate pulling up to a DCFC and seeing there are 2 or 3 guys only there because the electricity is free (i.e., they don't need to DCFC at all - they live around the corner). People like that block the limited amount of DCFC stations.

 

[SeanNelson]

Personally, I am *glad* that Chevy is not giving away those cards. I hate pulling up to a DCFC and seeing there are 2 or 3 guys only there because the electricity is free...

I am in 100% agreement!

 

[LeftieBiker]

We now have an EVGo station about 6 miles from me, after having no DCFC at all for years. I have never seen a single vehicle charging there. (I suspect that my non-QC-equipped Leaf, which is often parked there, may have been the reason they put a station there...) I think it makes more sense to put common sense restrictions on the card than to have none.

 

[SparkE]

We now have an EVGo station about 6 miles from me, after having no DCFC at all for years. I have never seen a single vehicle charging there. (I suspect that my non-QC-equipped Leaf, which is often parked there, may have been the reason they put a station there...) I think it makes more sense to put common sense restrictions on the card than to have none.

it makes more sense to put common sense restrictions on the card than to have none

Well, I would have no problem with any car company giving away a NEW card for EVgo (and calling it "My EV for Free" or whatever stupid marketing name they pick) - IF it was simply one of the "new" EVgo membership cards, and they paid the subscription fee for the first 2 years (which would basically come down to "$10 worth of free charging a month - any extra you pay for"). That would be a win-win for everybody (especially EVgo).

(See posts on new EVgo terms, here : http://www.mychevybolt.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=5834&p=29906#p29906 ).

 

[like2bike]

So here's a question for Chevrolet, and I apologize if this has already been asked (but I didn't see it in this forum). Why doesn't Chevrolet offer special charging rates for public charging, such as Nissan and BMW offer? It really seems as if GM is producing this car only because it's forced to, kicking and screaming.

I agree. The Bolt seems like a new kind of compliance car. They love the publicity of have a car that is competitive with the Model 3, as long as they don't have to sell too many of them. And they seem to be succeeding in limiting demand, although I'm not quite sure how they have done that other than with the ridiculous front seat problem. Swiping $5000 of the tax credit when you lease is a good one too. More evidence they don't really want to sell it for the stated price.

 

[SparkE]

Go back to school and learn about economics; there's a thing called supply and demand.

"they seem to be succeeding in limiting demand" - nope. They are managing to sell every one they make, with people waiting for the cars to show up so that they can buy them. The one exception seems to be some spots in Calif, which got over a hundred at a shot, and it took a while for them to all get sold.

"Swiping $5000 of the tax credit when you lease ...". nope. The buyer of the car gets the tax credit. The person who leases isn't the buyer - the person who leases in renting the car from the buyer. If you don't like the lease details from GM, you can go to any bank or third party leasing company, and lease from them instead.

"More evidence they don't really want to sell it for the stated price". This one confuses me - I really don't understand what you are getting at. Many people have reported paying UNDER the MSRP (see this thread : http://www.mychevybolt.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=4770 ). ( or this one : http://www.chevybolt.org/forum/55-2017-chevy-bolt-ev-pricing-dealers-orders-tracking/4593-how-much-were-you-able-get-below-msrp.html )

 

[LeftieBiker]

they seem to be succeeding in limiting demand" - nope. They are managing to sell every one they make, with people waiting for the cars to show up so that they can buy them. The one exception seems to be some spots in Calif, which got over a hundred at a shot, and it took a while for them to all get sold.

They may eventually "sell every one they make" but not easily. I can choose between two 2017 Premieres and four 2017 LTs locally, and there were never many more than that available here. California is not the US. As for GMAC keeping $5k of the Federal rebate, your response would be more persuasive if other manufacturers' leasing arms didn't pass the full credit on to the lessee.

 

[SparkE]

As for GMAC keeping $5k of the Federal rebate, your response would be more persuasive if other manufacturers' leasing arms didn't pass the full credit on to the lessee.

If you don't like the deal, use a different leasing company. If you can't get a better deal elsewhere, then the GM deal isn't that bad, is it? If you can get a better deal elsewhere why in all that is sane are you leasing through GM?

 

[SparkE]

they seem to be succeeding in limiting demand" - nope. They are managing to sell every one they make, with people waiting for the cars to show up so that they can buy them. The one exception seems to be some spots in Calif, which got over a hundred at a shot, and it took a while for them to all get sold.

They may eventually "sell every one they make" but not easily. I can choose between two 2017 Premieres and four 2017 LTs locally, and there were never many more than that available here. California is not the US.

I'm not seeing your point. You are saying that there are very few sitting around where you are. In my mind, that means that there isn't a glut of them there - they are selling them. So why are they not selling every one they make "easily"? I really don't understand your reasoning.

 

[Bacardi]

So here's a question for Chevrolet, and I apologize if this has already been asked (but I didn't see it in this forum). Why doesn't Chevrolet offer special charging rates for public charging, such as Nissan and BMW offer? It really seems as if GM is producing this car only because it's forced to, kicking and screaming.

To oversimplify OPs question, they want free stuff so they believe their best course of action is to mention that two competitors offer this incentive (and have for years) along with attempting to insult GM by passively aggressively calling the Bolt a compliance car...Hopefully GM will either now offer this or answer truthfully to why they do not want to pay for Bolt EV owners charging...

To add insult to injury, GM does offer a FREE charging program to Bolt EV RENTERS; its for those who rent a Bolt EV for Lyft or Maven receive a free charging membership in some markets...The GM free charge program exists, all they have to do is open the existing program every Bolt but they elect not to...

Chevy has not had a "real" reply since last summer, they did log in (probably reset their password) on Halloween and posted 5 "if you're still having issues email us"...As they've stated on here, in their profile and signature, they state their FB and twitter feeds and are very active on their, also Chevy's main site has an EV option on Live Chat...

 

[SmokingRubber]

Chevy is in the business of selling cars, not selling or giving away free gas. Tesla is the exception because as a new company selling an essentially new technology, they recognized they had to do both to be successful. If the Chargepoint and EVGo infrastructure were in place like they are today, Tesla would be less likely to have started the supercharger network.

Tesla sells a lot of electric cars for $100k+ ... Chevy definitely doesn't. Nissan was an early adopter so they had to assist owners with infrastructure by way of a marriage with EVGo. Chevy and the rest are riding the coat-tails. I'd LOVE it if there was a SuperChevyCharger network with FREE 120amp chargers spread out across the world ... but there isn't and there doesn't really need to be. I bought it to use it as a commuter, and I get free juice at work, so it works perfectly for me. If I wanted to do a bunch of road trips I'd have bought a Tesla.

 

[mwk]

Chevy is in the business of selling cars, not selling or giving away free gas. Tesla is the exception because as a new company selling an essentially new technology, they recognized they had to do both to be successful. If the Chargepoint and EVGo infrastructure were in place like they are today, Tesla would be less likely to have started the supercharger network.

Tesla sells a lot of electric cars for $100k+ ... Chevy definitely doesn't. Nissan was an early adopter so they had to assist owners with infrastructure by way of a marriage with EVGo. Chevy and the rest are riding the coat-tails. I'd LOVE it if there was a SuperChevyCharger network with FREE 120amp chargers spread out across the world ... but there isn't and there doesn't really need to be. I bought it to use it as a commuter, and I get free juice at work, so it works perfectly for me. If I wanted to do a bunch of road trips I'd have bought a Tesla.

Guess what? Tesla is the ONE electric car manufacturer that really does NOT need to provide a network of chargers, for the same reason you mentioned. Most people get "free juice" at work or plug it in at home. People buy Teslas, not because they can drive cross country and use the Superchargers, but because they are "cool", and "fun". The Model 3 isn't significantly better than the Bolt, but people are willing to wait a year to get one, just because it's a Tesla. With that kind of brand recognition, they are the ones that least need to build out their own network of chargers.

 

[SmokingRubber]

Chevy is in the business of selling cars, not selling or giving away free gas. Tesla is the exception because as a new company selling an essentially new technology, they recognized they had to do both to be successful. If the Chargepoint and EVGo infrastructure were in place like they are today, Tesla would be less likely to have started the supercharger network.

Tesla sells a lot of electric cars for $100k+ ... Chevy definitely doesn't. Nissan was an early adopter so they had to assist owners with infrastructure by way of a marriage with EVGo. Chevy and the rest are riding the coat-tails. I'd LOVE it if there was a SuperChevyCharger network with FREE 120amp chargers spread out across the world ... but there isn't and there doesn't really need to be. I bought it to use it as a commuter, and I get free juice at work, so it works perfectly for me. If I wanted to do a bunch of road trips I'd have bought a Tesla.

Guess what? Tesla is the ONE electric car manufacturer that really does NOT need to provide a network of chargers, for the same reason you mentioned. Most people get "free juice" at work or plug it in at home. People buy Teslas, not because they can drive cross country and use the Superchargers, but because they are "cool", and "fun". The Model 3 isn't significantly better than the Bolt, but people are willing to wait a year to get one, just because it's a Tesla. With that kind of brand recognition, they are the ones that least need to build out their own network of chargers.

My point is, at the time Tesla started they needed to build the supercharger network because there was really no infrastructure in place. Most of the other manufacturers are jumping on the EV bandwagon pretty late. They're going to ride the wave and let someone else build the infrastructure.

 

[SparkE]

Read this thread, starting at this post (http://www.mychevybolt.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=7564&p=30142#p30131 ) and after.

The CCS infrastructure is going without GM having to do anything at all.

 

[Bacardi]

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1116202_gm-evgo-to-build-chevy-bolt-ev-fast-charging-network-for-maven-drivers-only

 

[Campfamily]

As for GMAC keeping $5k of the Federal rebate, your response would be more persuasive if other manufacturers' leasing arms didn't pass the full credit on to the lessee.

Chevy accounts for this "theft" by having artificially high residual values on their leases. Does anybody really think a Bolt will be worth 60% of it's MSRP in 3 years? For comparison, the residual on a Ford Focus Electric is only 38%, but Ford passes the entire $7500 on to the lease holder in the form of a rebate.

 

[GetOffYourGas]

As for GMAC keeping $5k of the Federal rebate, your response would be more persuasive if other manufacturers' leasing arms didn't pass the full credit on to the lessee.

Chevy accounts for this "theft" by having artificially high residual values on their leases. Does anybody really think a Bolt will be worth 60% of it's MSRP in 3 years? For comparison, the residual on a Ford Focus Electric is only 38%, but Ford passes the entire $7500 on to the lease holder in the form of a rebate.

Exactly. It's only a "theft" if you buy out the car at the end of your lease, for the artificially inflated residual. How many people do that? I'm guessing zero. You either return the car or negotiate a lower buyout price. GM, unlike Ford, will negotiate.

 

[Arob216]

Well, I would have no problem with any car company giving away a NEW card for EVgo (and calling it "My EV for Free" or whatever stupid marketing name they pick) - IF it was simply one of the "new" EVgo membership cards, and they paid the subscription fee for the first 2 years (which would basically come down to "$10 worth of free charging a month - any extra you pay for"). That would be a win-win for everybody (especially EVgo).

That would make a lot of sense! I'm sure if GM partnered with evGo, they could drive their cost down to $50 or less for a 2 yr pre-paid membership per EV they sell as the number of owners who would actually use the $10 monthly credit would seem to be pretty small, and in turn it would be the best possible advertising evGo could buy. GM could even partner with evGo to put CCS chargers at every GM dealer.

The dealer I bought mine at has a 110V outlet in the service bay, nothing else. They typically have 1 Bolt on the lot, presumably because GM requires them to put at least one of every model on the lot. This despite the fact that the Denver metro area is one of the more assertive clean energy locations in the region.

The Dealer knew little about EVs, so they added very little value to my purchase experience. In all honesty, I would have been better served buying through an online store ala Tesla. This EV revolution is either going to put traditional dealers out of business, or reward the few who embrace it.

If they had a CCS on-site, they could have walked me through activating an evGo account, putting me on the "free" charge for 30-45 minutes, and achieved a useful buying experience in the process. As it was, I hobbled home with 10 miles of range to spare and the Bolt sat for 3 days on my 110V outlet to get enough of a charge to get to\from work. Fortunately, my L2 charger arrived, and electrician was able to put in a circuit at that point. My expectation is to use CCS maybe 5 times per year, on extreme weather days, and if I venture outside my "normal" range to try a road trip.

 

[BillM]

It is pretty lame if a dealer does not have at least one 240 Volt Level 2 charger. For at least the 2017 tax year, there was an up to 30% US federal tax credit for installing an electric charging apparatus which applied to both individuals and businesses. I have not seen the tax rules for 2018.

The Walmart near me installed two Level 2 chargers and a (50 KW?) DC fast charger on EvGo. The two Level 2 chargers are near the building, probably to keep the wiring short and thus are prime spots and nearly always have their spots occupied by ICE cars. The DC charger is off to the side, and I’ve never seen anybody using it - probably because the price for the electricity is high. The DC charger must look intimidating because I’ve never seeen an ICE car parked in its space.