Nitrogen in the tires

[Tarrngtn]

Does anyone know whether these self sealing tires are filled with nitrogen instead of air? My mechanical engineer buddy says nitrogen is better because it does not react with the rubber. But I thought perhaps these tires already have pure nitrogen. Also, I am concerned about whether it would hurt these tires to flatten them and then reinflate.

 

[EldRick]

The difference between 100% nitrogen and the 79% nitrogen you've already got is so trivial that only racers actually get an advantage from the practice.

Think of it this way: does the outside of a rubber tire need to be in 100% nitrogen? :lol:
Guess what - the outside is exposed to lots more oxygen than the inside, because the trivial amount of ozone on the inside gets absorbed by reacting and then it stops, while the outside is constantly bathed in fresh oxygen and reactive ozone, and UV radiation besides.

Don't waste your time or money - any advantage of nitrogen-fill is so small as to be theoretical and unmeasurable in actual use, particularly in a car that is limited to 93mph. (For my [theoretical] 200mph Tesla Roadster I'd insist on nitrogen...)

 

[Collimare]

I change all my tires to Nitrogen just to keep the pressure sensors happy year round. Less pressure change with temperature changes including extended hard fast running. Will maintain pressure over a longer period. I go years on my Airstream before needing to add.

 

[SeanNelson]

I change all my tires to Nitrogen just to keep the pressure sensors happy year round. Less pressure change with temperature changes including extended hard fast running. Will maintain pressure over a longer period. I go years on my Airstream before needing to add.

The dealer put nitrogen in my tires as part of the pre-delivery prep, but I swapped out the front tires for snows shortly after buying the car and they were filed with good ol' fashioned air. I've been monitoring the pressures via the TPMS system and so far I haven't seen any notable differences between the two pairs, even during long freeway runs.

 

[drfoto]

My wife's BMW X3 shows constant warning messages as soon as the weather turns cold if the tires contain air. Filled with nitrogen (free at Costco) the problem goes away entirely. The sensitivity of the system may vary by manufacturer, but in my experience is not theoretical at all with a sensitive tire pressure system.

 

[EldRick]

"Less pressure change with temperature changes..."

Not true. See Boyle's Law for further information.

 

[PackardV8]

Agree; nitrogen in tires is akin to religion. Some have faith in it not supported by any physical fact.

jack vines

 

[gpsman]

The reason nascar and airlines use nitrogen is more simple than you think.

The cylinders contain up to 2500 psi.
Want to fill a tire FAST?
Use higher pressure.

Also- you don’t need electricity (aka compressor).
You can fill tires “anywhere”.

It has nothing to do with chemistry.
It has nothing to do with keeping better pressure.

N2 cylinders are dryer than regular non-dried compressed air, but it is not difficult or expensive to make dried compressed air.

In NASCAR, IF a car came in with literally burning rubber, (about 1000 times more likely than in your car) the nitrogen will slow the burning, not enhance the burning, and if done while refilling COULD help suppress the fire. But this is not WHY they do it.

They do it because the high pressure fills quicker, and the cyclinders are portable and do not require electricity.

 

[EldRick]

Nitrogen inflation is a harmless way to separate you from a few dollars at the tire shop, but lightening your wallet is the only performance-related effect.
A better use of the money would be tipping the installer in advance, to not scar the wheels or the bead and get a good balancing job.

 

[SeanNelson]

...because the high pressure fills quicker...

I'm not getting the connection between high pressure and nitrogen here. I use high pressure (3000psi) tanks for diving, and they contain regular old air. You don't need nitrogen to get high pressure.

 

[Collimare]

No science just years of personal experience. Costco provides it free as a service to it’s customers because Costco feels it is better. Don’t think they go to the expense if they felt it had no value/benefit. Perhaps it is just placebo effect with the sensors what ever it is it keeps them happy...

 

[IMAdolt]

No science just years of personal experience. Costco provides it free as a service to it’s customers because Costco feels it is better. Don’t think they go to the expense if they felt it had no value/benefit. Perhaps it is just placebo effect with the sensors what ever it is it keeps them happy...

Costco aint dumb, they do it for the same reason they sell a $1.50 (in CAD) hotdog and pop at the cafeteria and handout samples, it gets ***** in store. If someone is getting their tires filled up for the free nitro I'm guessing they're also getting them serviced there too for the most part.

 

[EldRick]

Right - it is a way to differentiate themselves from every other tire outlet, inexpensively. It's a business ploy, not a performance improvement.

Don’t think they go to the expense if they felt it had no value/benefit.

The benefit and value is to their marketing, nothing more.

 

[TimBolt]

I use helium, I had to add a couple of bags of Sakrete in the trunk to keep my Bolt from floating away.

 

[EldRick]

"Certainly, if you fall into one or more of the categories below, using nitrogen could be beneficial:
If you have one or more cars that are primarily used at the racetrack
If you drive very sparingly and your car sits unused for an extended time
If you own collectible cars that are seldom driven any great distances
If you have to put your car in storage for a significant period of time

If you use your car on a regular basis for daily driving and don’t fall into any of the above categories, it’s difficult to see how using nitrogen gives you any practical benefits, especially compared to its cost and inconvenience."

https://www.tirebuyer.com/education/nitrogen-vs-air

"Yes, nitrogen is technically a better gas to fill tires with than air, though it’s not really so much about nitrogen itself as it is not having water vapor in your tires.
Is it worth it? For normal driving, probably not. The advantages, while real, are still really very miniscule."

https://jalopnik.com/heres-the-deal-with-nitrogen-filled-tires-1795659391

 

[gpsman]

I looked it up. I was about to say the main difference is water content, but someone beat me to it.

Compressed air will vary, but undried air can have up to 10,000 ppm (parts per million) water vapor.

Nitrogen is most commonly distilled from air.
Nitrogen purchased in high pressure cylinders will commonly have 1 to 5 ppm water vapor.

For the extremist, Argon cylinders typically have 1 ppb (1 part per billion) water vapor.

I also looked up the price of bottled nitrogen.
Back of the napkin guesstimate is one of the large cylinders will fill about 100 car tires (@35 psi). Retail price if I wanted one cylinder is $70.

Places like Costco who buy in bulk may get it at half that price. So my assertion that NASCAR, Airlines, and Costco use nitrogen PRIMARILY for convenience holds water. It’s cheap. Not cheaper than plain-old compressed air, but maybe on par with DRIED compressed air, and why bother buying the extra equipment, to dry the air, if there is an easier, electricity free, portable system with no moving parts?

 

[EldRick]

There are also units sized for a tire outlet that collect nitrogen directly from the air. I don't know what moisture content they produce.