Driving LA to San Francisco

To drive to San Francisco from my home in LA, I would have to charge at the Harris Ranch which is a 220 mile trip. With a full charge, I could make the next leg of 183 miles easily. I am reluctant to try to make the first leg. Anyone been this venturesome?

Fulmine said:

To drive to San Francisco from my home in LA, I would have to charge at the Harris Ranch which is a 220 mile trip. With a full charge, I could make the next leg of 183 miles easily. I am reluctant to try to make the first leg. Anyone been this venturesome?

Click to expand...

Not a good plan or route.

Harris Ranch has a CHAdeMO DCFC, which the Bolt can NOT use.

Even beyond that:

A bit of wind can reduce range. As can driving faster, hills, not even to mention rain, snow, .... Don't push range without an alternative charging plan.

In general:
You should never plan on such a long leg with no alternatives. What if you get there, and the charger is down? What if a rainstorm including winds reduces your range and you don't get there?

Shorter legs are faster because the car chargers faster between 20% and 50% than it does at higher SOCs.

If you are using PlugShare to find charging locations for planning, go the the settings page and turn of CHAdeMO, Tesla and everything else your car can't use. Taking a portable EVSE you might want NEMA 14-50, probably want "Wall Outlet (120V)" off unless you plan on a very long stop.

Looking at the PlugShare and ChargePoint maps, it appears the density of chargers, especially DCFC, between LA and San Francisco is much better along the 101.

There are plenty of EVgo CCS chargers along CA-99. A user on another Bolt forum did the same trip as you want to and blogged about it:

http://boltev.blogspot.com

Yes, I know. I wonder why the density of chargers is so much higher along the relatively less-travelled 99 compared to Interstate 5. Driving 99 is kind of the long way around to make this particular trip.

roundpeg said:

Yes, I know. I wonder why the density of chargers is so much higher along the relatively less-travelled 99 compared to Interstate 5. Driving 99 is kind of the long way around to make this particular trip.

Click to expand...

Have you ever driven 99? I doubt it's less traveled than I5. CA99 has Modesto, Merced, Fresno and Bakersfield - each with major traffic tie-ups. Interstate 5 has.... lots and lots of open space with no population centers between the Grapevine and Livermore.

dandrewk said:

Have you ever driven 99? I doubt it's less traveled than I5. CA99 has Modesto, Merced, Fresno and Bakersfield - each with major traffic tie-ups. Interstate 5 has.... lots and lots of open space with no population centers between the Grapevine and Livermore.

Click to expand...

Only hundreds of times, mostly when I am headed to the Sierras. Interstate 5 doesn't pass through as many urban areas but it is shortest and fastest route between the Bay and LA areas. It's always been a solid wall of trucks when I've been on it.

Be advised - there are NO charging stations along I-5 North of Castaic. If you go up I-5, you would have to go over Hwy 152 to Gilroy and then North on Hwy 101. There is an EVgo quick charge station at the Gilroy Outlets. Hwy 99 has many quick-charge locations starting in Bakersfield. Check PlugShare for all locations. The road along Hwy 99 is good. I-5 tends to be bad in places thanks to the truck traffic.

roundpeg said:

dandrewk said:

Have you ever driven 99? I doubt it's less traveled than I5. CA99 has Modesto, Merced, Fresno and Bakersfield - each with major traffic tie-ups. Interstate 5 has.... lots and lots of open space with no population centers between the Grapevine and Livermore.

Click to expand...

Only hundreds of times, mostly when I am headed to the Sierras. Interstate 5 doesn't pass through as many urban areas but it is shortest and fastest route between the Bay and LA areas. It's always been a solid wall of trucks when I've been on it.

Click to expand...

I've been on both. By far, CA99 is way more heavily traveled. Go on a weekday and you will be confronted with half a dozen stop/go traffic areas. I5 has more trucks, but generally they stay over to the right. Once past the Grapevine, the only tie-ups are for accidents, spills etc.

dandrewk said:

I've been on both. By far, CA99 is way more heavily traveled. Go on a weekday and you will be confronted with half a dozen stop/go traffic areas. I5 has more trucks, but generally they stay over to the right. Once past the Grapevine, the only tie-ups are for accidents, spills etc.

Click to expand...

I know, 99 is definitely more urban and will frequently jam up through Fresno, Modesto, etc. but as far as cross-country from the Bay to LA, probably 5 carries most of that traffic. So it depends on what you mean. For sure 5 is a charger wasteland. I believe Harris Ranch is about the only place to get DCFC between Bakersfield and the East Bay. Faced with that drive I'd go 101. San Luis Obispo, Paso Robles, King City, Salinas.

Neither ChargePoint nor PlugShare show a CCS quick charge location along I-5 North of Castaic all the way to Tracy, CA. What is at Harris Ranch? The Bolt requires a CCS quick charge connection which is available at many locations along Hwy 99. Hwy 101 is a good option too but it is a longer route.

roundpeg said:

dandrewk said:

I've been on both. By far, CA99 is way more heavily traveled. Go on a weekday and you will be confronted with half a dozen stop/go traffic areas. I5 has more trucks, but generally they stay over to the right. Once past the Grapevine, the only tie-ups are for accidents, spills etc.

Click to expand...

I know, 99 is definitely more urban and will frequently jam up through Fresno, Modesto, etc. but as far as cross-country from the Bay to LA, probably 5 carries most of that traffic. So it depends on what you mean. For sure 5 is a charger wasteland. I believe Harris Ranch is about the only place to get DCFC between Bakersfield and the East Bay. Faced with that drive I'd go 101. San Luis Obispo, Paso Robles, King City, Salinas.

Click to expand...

Understood, but I still think 99 has more volume. There is a lot of intra/inter city traffic, and several spots where there are four lanes of heavy urban traffic.

Of course, we'd all love it if I5 was more EV friendly. Put in a dozen or more ccs/chademo units in the usual pit stops (Kettleman, etc.) and things would be much better. I don't know how the slimes at NRG got away without fully populating the most important N/S artery.

99 hwy is only 30 miles longer than the 5. Best strategy is full charge at start and DCFC at low SOC.

CA-99 is fine for EVgo subscribers, and US-101 is about the only choice for ChargePoint users (EVgo is on US-101 as well).

The only (currently working) 50 kW spot for ChargePoint (CP) subs is N of Santa Barbara, at Santa Ynez Marriott in Buellton (at least there are two units). It'd be nice to get another pair of (CP) 50 kW chargers around King City - that'd be great for the SF Bay Area/L.A. route on US-101. As it stands, there are 24 kW (CP) DCFCs in Paso Robles, King City, Salinas (free!), and Morgan Hill (2). There's another 50 kW DCFC at ChargePoint headquarters in Campbell (near where CA-85 crosses CA-17) and FOUR 50 kW chargers in San Mateo just south of SFO (the airport, that is - where CA-92 crosses US-101).

So for a Bolt, LA-SF on 101 is quite do-able : fill to 80% in Buellton, then stop to get an extra 10 kWh in Paso Robles or King City (to be absolutely sure you have enough to get to Morgan Hill), then stop for a snack in Salinas or Morgan Hill before getting a 'big gulp' of electrons at Campbell, or Intel in Santa Clara (another 50 kW spot) or in Fremont (two 50 kW chargers, $4.50 connect fee with no per-kWh fee) or San Mateo.

The 'no 50 kW DCFC near King City' is a bummer, but there are lots of 24 kW chargers to get the extra 10 kWh needed to get to the next one. And that stretch (well, San Jose to San Miguel on US-101) is a top priority for the CA electric highway. It's not there yet, though.

Fulmine said:

To drive to San Francisco from my home in LA, I would have to charge at the Harris Ranch which is a 220 mile trip. With a full charge, I could make the next leg of 183 miles easily. I am reluctant to try to make the first leg. Anyone been this venturesome?

Click to expand...

Here are preliminary results for a trip model I've been working on for the Bolt EV. This one starts in downtown LA and goes to downtown SF. The distance to Harris Ranch is ~197 mi, so this trip is a little shorter than yours. The distance from Harris Ranch to SF is 183 mi, which coincidently matches your second leg distance.

Some assumptions for this are:
Preliminary energy efficiency and battery charging models
65 mph in "urban areas" (first 39mi, last 55 mi)
75 mph everywhere else
Good weather (no wind, rain, snow, etc)
No HVAC use (Edited: was "Mid HVAC use, 1.5kW continuous")
No elevation changes (No regen losses down the Grapevine)
Planned discharge no lower than 15% SoC
CCS stations are installed in Castaic, Lebec, Grapevine, Buttonwillow, Harris Ranch, and Gustine (NONE of these exist today!)
Charging at 125A max (don't have any >50kW Bolt EV charging data to model)

With these assumptions, you cannot drive the Bolt EV over this route with only one stop.

It is doable with two stops (Buttonwillow & Gustine) but you have to recharge all the way to 95% at Buttonwillow, which adds 24 minutes over a three-stop trip.

The fastest trip is done with three stops as shown at Buttonwillow, Harris Ranch, and Gustine. This is 5 hr 17 min of driving plus 1hr 46 min for charging including a short allowance for charging prep. The three charging sessions are 30 min, 30 min and 34 min sequentially.

Zoomit said:

Fulmine said:

To drive to San Francisco from my home in LA, I would have to charge at the Harris Ranch which is a 220 mile trip. With a full charge, I could make the next leg of 183 miles easily. I am reluctant to try to make the first leg. Anyone been this venturesome?

Click to expand...

Here are preliminary results for a trip model I've been working on for the Bolt EV. This one starts in downtown LA and goes to downtown SF. The distance to Harris Ranch is ~197 mi, so this trip is a little shorter than yours. The distance from Harris Ranch to SF is 183 mi, which coincidently matches your second leg distance.

Some assumptions for this are:
Preliminary energy efficiency and battery charging models
65 mph in "urban areas" (first 39mi, last 55 mi)
75 mph everywhere else
Good weather (no wind, rain, snow, etc)
Mid HVAC use (1.5kW continuous)
No elevation changes (No regen losses down the Grapevine)
Planned discharge no lower than 15% SoC
CCS stations are installed in Castaic, Lebec, Grapevine, Buttonwillow, Harris Ranch, and Gustine (NONE of these exist today!)
Charging at 125A max (don't have any >50kW Bolt EV charging data to model)

With these assumptions, you cannot drive the Bolt EV over this route with only one stop.

It is doable with two stops (Buttonwillow & Gustine) but you have to recharge all the way to 95% at Buttonwillow, which adds 24 minutes over a three-stop trip.

The fastest trip is done with three stops as shown at Buttonwillow, Harris Ranch, and Gustine. This is 5 hr 17 min of driving plus 1hr 46 min for charging including a short allowance for charging prep. The three charging sessions are 30 min, 30 min and 34 min sequentially.

Click to expand...

Great information. Thanks for documenting it.

SparkEVPilot said:

What is at Harris Ranch?

Click to expand...

Coulda sworn I saw something at Harris Ranch before. Now I am not finding it. That's a big electron desert out there.

dandrewk said:

Of course, we'd all love it if I5 was more EV friendly. Put in a dozen or more ccs/chademo units in the usual pit stops (Kettleman, etc.) and things would be much better. I don't know how the slimes at NRG got away without fully populating the most important N/S artery.

Click to expand...

I suspect it's a matter of efficient use of resources. By adding chargers along the 99 you not only provide for LA to SF travel, but also service all of the cities along that route. Hopefully the 5 gets fully electrified soon, but I can see the logic for hitting the 99 first.

In anticipation of driving to Santa Cruz in mid-February, last Monday I drove from my home in Valley Village (North Hollywood) to Paso Robles (195 miles). Here are some of my observations:

My drive to Santa Cruz is about 330 miles and takes about 5 hours and 15 minutes of actual driving time, using Interstate 5, the fastest route and coming west either at the Pacheco Pass, Hiway 152 through Hollister to Watsonville to Santa Cruz or through Hiway 46 to US 101 (where James Dean died) and then taking 101 up to Salinas to Santa Cruz.

The problem is there currently are no DC Fast Chargers on Interstate 5 between Los Angeles (North of Castaic) and San Francisco. Hopefully NRG's EVGo and ChargePoint will fix this problem SOON!

This problem was alleviated when Chargepoint installed one at The Granary Building in Paso Robles near where Hiway 46 merges with US 101 and is about 196 miles from my home (and about 137 miles from my destination in Santa Cruz).

So, the question was, could I really make it to this charger in Paso Robles with the stated 220-230 mile capacity of the Chevy Bolt EV given the uphill drive North of Los Angeles through the Los Angeles National Forest to the Grapevine on Interstate 5?

Last Monday (January 30th) I determined the answer is easily YES!

I conservatively hypermiled the drive to be sure I would make it: no air conditioning (it was a mild day and I only used the fan). I usually drove 55-60 MHP and most of the time when not on the extreme uphill or downhill behind an 18 wheeler to get sucked into the vacuum created by his drive, with my cruise control at his speed of usually 60. I always drive in "L" to use regenerative braking.

I watched three gauges: the miles remaining on the battery (never completely accurate on my previous Chevy's Volt and now my Bolt EV as it is "environmentally" conditioned from previous days driving) but more accurately, the amount of KWh used (which will lower as the car regens electricity back into the battery) and of course the miles remaining to my destination on the NAV from my Apple CarPlay's NAV.

I started the trip with a 36 mile "gap" between battery range and actual miles to be driven. During the trip up towards the Grapevine this dropped to a minimum of 17. Once I passed the Tejon Summit and hit the downhill of the Grapevine, I got into the extreme right lane and was behind a car carrier that was going only 25-35 MPH (the speed limit for trucks in this lane is 45 to 35) with my flashers going.

I was able to regen a full 2 KWh's going down the Grapevine from 17.9KWh (having driven about 60 miles from home) back down to 15.9KWh about 5 miles later at the bottom. This added margin made the rest of the trip very comfortable even though I continued to hypermile, just to complete the experiment.

I reached Paso Robles at 3:10pm and started charging at 3:15pm with 70 miles "remaining" on the mileage gauge and 43.5 KWh used, so even if there was a problem with the single combo DC Fast Charger at this location in Paso Robles, I had plenty of juice left to backtrack 30 miles to San Luis Obispo to use one of the two combo chargers at the Marigold Center.

While I was having "Happy Hour" ceviche at a local restaurant in "old town Paso Robles" down 12 Street, the charger had a "Fault-Interrupt" after about 40 minutes and stopped charging. I called Chargepoint and they restarted the charger and topped me off to 80% with no further charging. It appears that this DC Fast Charger will go past 80% (which is more important to me returning to Los Angeles, than it is going North to Santa Cruz), but with the interrupt it was not clear from this trip.

Cool Hand Luke's Steakhouse had by then opened for business (4pm) and I had some wings while the charging continued.

I will have more information when I make the full trip to Santa Cruz in about 10 days.

NOTE: I did stop for lunch at Chipolte at the bottom of the Grapevine and made a courtesy stop at the Tesla SuperCharger; the current chargees came over with interest and helped me out with a photo!

Fulmine said:

To drive to San Francisco from my home in LA, I would have to charge at the Harris Ranch which is a 220 mile trip. With a full charge, I could make the next leg of 183 miles easily. I am reluctant to try to make the first leg. Anyone been this venturesome?

Click to expand...

I see 18kW consumption on a flat road at 65mph. This will give 216 miles out of 60kWh. If you drive 70mph (the speed limit on route 5), then consumption will be higher, and the range will be less. Hills, heat or AC use, etc. may also increase consumption and reduce range.